Why doctors were killing Rory

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Re: Why doctors were killing Rory

Postby blues blooded » 24 Jun 2012, 17:45

Olav wrote:Don't forget that Rory was very shy. And probably thougt that doctor can't be wrong.

Very true. I'm glad you found the right doctor. My father was diagnosed with prostate cancer 4 years ago and it should have been picked up. As it was it wasn't. He's done pretty well actually, but I think this year will be his last.

Granted he's 84, but he's still my dad and it will be awful when he does finally go.

So I don't have a lot of faith in the some of the medical professional. Cancer is an awful death and I wish he could die of old age
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Re: Why doctors were killing Rory

Postby Flamenca » 25 Jun 2012, 01:43

Sorry to pour cold water on this, but I never found Rory to be shy.
It was the biggest surprise for me to read that in Gerry McAvoy's book.
I didn't know Rory for as many years as Gerry, and everyone has their own experiences of people.

I found Rory to be extremely guarded, which is not the same as being shy.
He didn't share secrets or trade confidences that's for sure.
He was a little reserved when we first met probably because he wasn't in a good mood.
He'd been kept waiting with no explanation for some time, but he soon got over it and warmed up.

When Donal and I were talking in the pub on the night of the instrument preview, I deliberately asked him a leading question, just to see if my experiences of Rory were out of the ordinary. I asked Donal 'why do think Rory was so shy off-stage and so extrovert when performing'. He replied quite strongly 'Rory wasn't shy!'

I then knew that my memory of Rory was not incorrect, as his own brother knew him better than anyone, including Gerry - no offence intended to Gerry.

I found Rory to be a little old-fashioned in some of his attitudes and values - hence my explanation that I thought he was too old for me. I can easily believe that he was deferential to professionally qualified 'experts' and placed too much trust in them.

I don't think it was just the booze although he was very fond of it - he probably even named his first band after The Taste of it. I have wondered if he had thyroid disease because his weight went up and down noticebly and he sweated so heavily.

I don't think he was drinking any more or less alcohol than any of the other guys on tour in the 1970s. I suspect he had an underlying medical condition, possibly thyroid disease or possibly depression, that wasn't diagnosed, hence untreated, and the anti-anxiety medication prescribed, was probably Valium - a popular choice of doctors at that time.

Once he got hooked ... the rest of the story played out ...
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Re: Why doctors were killing Rory

Postby Olav » 25 Jun 2012, 18:57

Sorry,Flamenca, but sometimes you forget the main rule - to respect Rory. You say again that he was too old for you. Did he ask you for a date, or maybe he proposed to you? Or maybe you want to look so important person ? If you were not even friends with him, as you told before, why you care of the fact that he was older than you?
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Re: Why doctors were killing Rory

Postby Jay Jay » 25 Jun 2012, 19:45

Flamenca wrote:I found Rory to be a little old-fashioned in some of his attitudes and values - hence my explanation that I thought he was too old for me. I can easily believe that he was deferential to professionally qualified 'experts' and placed too much trust in them.


Flamenca with respect also ..

Noway he was old fashioned. Rory was way ahead of his time especially in the 70's. Plus noway he was shy even in the 80's as I've heard off stage from numerous folk who had company with him over the years. He was introvert a lttle yes off stage, then extrovert on stage ..

He possibly also later in the 80's as they used to call it had manic depression. Nowadays it's called by-polar disorder. Which I suffered terribly when I stopped playing gigs or playing music on stage. Rory possibly missed the audience applause / adulation not touring gigging so often?

A little Dr Jekyll and little Mr Hyde .. Or maybe all our thoughts are running a little wild free as a child into the night?? :?
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Re: Why doctors were killing Rory

Postby blues blooded » 25 Jun 2012, 19:49

Olav wrote:Sorry,Flamenca, but sometimes you forget the main rule - to respect Rory. You say again that he was too old for you. Did he ask you for a date, or maybe he proposed to you? Or maybe you want to look so important person ? If you were not even friends with him, as you told before, why you care of the fact that he was older than you?


I don't think she was being disrespectful at all and she was merely voicing an opinion. I very much doubt that Rory would want obsequious fawning. Why are you so angry at someone saying he was too old? She was hardly slagging him off :roll:
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Re: Why doctors were killing Rory

Postby Olav » 25 Jun 2012, 20:10

I'm not angry if someone saying he was too old. The thing is that Flamenca told before in the other discussion that he was too old for her to date.And a lot of people were telling her that this age gap means nothing for real love.That she didn't make Rory happy and so on. And I thought then, that all this story looks strange as if she rejected his love. When she repeated about his age in this place I wrote these words.
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Re: Why doctors were killing Rory

Postby Flamenca » 26 Jun 2012, 03:11

Mmmm ... this one seems to have hit a chord :?

With all due respect folks, I don't think there's anyone (and please correct me if I'm wrong) posting on these boards, who actually knew Rory ... apart from me ... and I don't claim to have known him well.

I've worked in the music industry for 35 years, 27 of which have been in management at major label record, publishing and recording studio companies, apart from the five and half years I spent in L.A. working in television. Our paths crossed socially on occasions in pubs and restaurants over the years, but I met him formally through work in 1988.

I can only give you my impression of him in the late 1980s when I got to know him slightly better.

I was a fan in the 1970s. At that time, as far as I could tell, he was happy, fun, and gorgeous. He didn't seem shy when kissing Caitlin McAreavy or McCready (or whatever her name was) on stage on 3rd March 1973. I asked Donal if he remembered that night. Unfortunately, he didn't.

When I bumped into Rory a few times in 1984 he had mellowed with age but was still friendly and would smile and say hello, even though he didn't really know Phil (my boyfriend at the time) or me. He wasn't shy towards us then either. Phil actually asked me if I knew him because he was surprised at Rory's warmth. In hindsight I think it could have been for a number of reasons. We were a mixed race couple - unusual in South Kensington at the time - Phil was from Barbados; or it could have been because Rory had seen Phil at Touche Ross (Rory's accountants) where Phil worked as an Audit Manager, and recognised him, or because he was just being friendly. We saw him a few times at a French bistro on the Fulham Road just down from the Michelin Building. I don't remember the name of the place. That's where we saw him with the Celtic looking woman. I don't remember much about her either other than I think she was a musician and they seemed close.

When I was formally introduced to him in 1988 at the major record label where I worked, I was shocked. I wasn't expecting to see him looking like this. I don't know the date of this photo but this is a fair representation of what he looked like in 1988 when we were introduced.
Rory+Gallagher 4.jpg


His whole demeanour had changed from how I remembered him. I’d never seen him looking overweight before. He didn't like record companies anyway, and he had been kept waiting about 15-20 minutes in reception, and then a further half hour or more in the Operations Director's office, where I was sent to keep him amused whilst he waited. They wouldn't have treated Eric Clapton that way. Understandably he was slightly put out. Frankly it was rude. He seemed to warm to me though because we talked about guitar playing etc. I met him a few times after that in pubs. He asked me to join him for drinks and to go to a couple of his shows. I didn't turn up because I thought he was too old for me. The reason I felt that was because there were times when he made me feel like I was up before the headmaster and had to explain myself. That's what I meant by old-fashioned. I never saw him put guys on the spot like that. Jekyll-Hyde ... no I don't think so. More a case of the older man assuming he's in charge, or so I thought at the time. I'm too independent for that. With hindsight, I was probably too harsh on him.

JayJay - so sorry to hear you have suffered from bi-polar disorder. It must have been terrible for you. I do understand the feeling of loss, although I have yet to feel it myself. I never enjoyed performing for an audience. I suffered terrible stage fright, so much so that I gave up performing publicly.

I have worked in the entertainment industry my whole career, working with famous, creative people, and living in a neighbourhood where famous, creative people are my neighbours. If I had to live my life any other way, I would probably start counting down the days to death or run away with the circus ... Possibly sad to some, but not me. I enjoy being around intelligent, creative people.

I currently work for a rock star. My boss - the bloke I work with five days a week, is an idol to his fans ... but to me, he's the bloke who can't be bothered to learn how to use a cash point machine or to fill up his own car ... why bother when there's always someone on your payroll to do that for you? That lifestyle must be addictive and I think it would be very difficult for anyone to come down to reality from it.
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Re: Why doctors were killing Rory

Postby Olav » 26 Jun 2012, 05:00

Sorry, Flamenca and thank you for your story. But it was better to tell it from the start to avoid any misunderstanding. Because some words as "master and pet" relationship were sounding strange , not only me have noticed it. And there is Bibi on this board, whom I respect very much for what she is doing now, who knew Rory. And she never made any intrigue out of it, though she was so beautiful girl on the photo standing next to Rory.
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Re: Why doctors were killing Rory

Postby Flamenca » 26 Jun 2012, 10:11

Apology accepted. No offence intended or received.

To answer your question about the intrigue, it's not intentional.
I'm an unassuming person. You have to have a very high level of humility to work with 'stars'. No point in getting upset when they are 'thoughtless' or you'd lose your job, because it would happen too often. I still work in the music industry so have my credibility to consider.

Additionally, if you could see some of the fan letters my boss receives you would realise just how many star struck people there are out there! I don't want any of them knocking on my door any time trying to reach him through me :mrgreen:

Regarding the 'owner-pet' joke, much as I'd love to claim that for myself, I can't.
It's taken from the book/movie 'About A Boy' written by Nick Hornby.
Apologies if it offended anyone.
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Re: Why doctors were killing Rory

Postby tonetanner » 26 Jun 2012, 10:54

OK, lets get back to the thread topic.
I don't equate Rory's place in society to Elvis or Wacko - they were the extremes of what fame can do, and they were USA cases, and not particularly relevant.
I worked in the NHS as a registered nurse between 1986 - 2000. I came across a lot of people who has serious illnesses and died young. Doctors can't cure everything, and in some cases not much at all. Often, they will persevere with 'medical' treatments instead of 'holistic' treatments because that is what they spent seven years in med school learning, so why should someone with far less 'training' than them know better (not my thoughts - holistic is good too)? People still trust doctors probably more than they should, but we all need to educate ourselves if you like more about what is 'good' for you and what is 'bad' for you, and to have the courage to challenge medical and popular opinion if it doesn't seem to be working. All of this leads up to the liver transplant, which could have kept Rory alive today if it succeeded. What ultimately killed him was MRSA - very little treats it, and people still die from it today. Anyone could have given it to him - doctors, nurses, cleaners, visitors. I will accept that his doctors probably contributed to making Rory serioulsy ill from liver disease, but an infection control failure at his hospital was the real cause of death.
TT
what do you think of that?
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